Episode 117: How Athavan got a graduate job with PwC

June 28, 2021 Podcast

For the 117th episode of the Graduate Job Podcast, I speak with a listener of the show Athavan, as he shares his experiences of getting a graduate job with top graduate employer PwC. Athavan is an alumnus of the How to Get a Graduate Job course, and he shares his insights of applying for graduate schemes with the big 4, finance companies, the civil service and general business management graduate schemes. We discuss the struggles he went through, advice at each stage of the process, and errors and mistakes that he made along the way. No matter what type of graduate job you are applying to, Athavan will be sharing insider tips to help you perform and stand out from the crowd. Now the only link you need to remember today is www.graduatejobpodcast.com/Athavan which has all of the links to everything we discuss today, including the details and dates of when the How to Get a Graduate Job course will reopen. So without further ado, let’s head across to my chat with Athavan.

MORE SPECIFICALLY IN THIS EPISODE YOU’LL LEARN ABOUT:

  • What you need to do to impress when you apply to PwC or the big 4
  • Questions you will face in the assessment centre for a graduate job with PwC
  • How to ensure you get through the initial application phase when you apply for a graduate job
  • What you can expect from the partner interview with the big 4
  • The importance of focus with your graduate job applications
  • Why Athavan joined the How to Get a Graduate Job course, and why he thinks you should too

SELECTED LINKS INCLUDE:

Transcript 117 – How Athavan got a graduate job with PwC

Announcer: Welcome to the Graduate Job Podcast, your home for weekly information and inspiration to help you get the graduate job of your dreams.

James Curran: Hello and welcome to the Graduate Job Podcast, with your host James Curran. The Graduate Job Podcast is your home for all things related to helping you on your journey to finding that amazing job. Each episode I bring together the best minds in the industry, speaking to leading authors, graduate recruiters and career coaches who bring decades of experience into a byte size show. Put simply, this is the show I wish I had when I graduated.

James: Hello, welcome to the show today, I’m very excited to have you with me for a very special episode, as following hot on the heels of my last episodes with listeners to the show Jack and Callum in episodes 115 and 116 respectively, I am today joined by fellow course alumni member Athavan, as he shares how he managed to get a graduate job with PwC. Athavan is just like you, a listener to the show who decided to sign up to the first launch of my course last September, and in today’s episode he shares his journey from graduating in 2019 through to bagging his dream graduate job with PwC. He shares his first-hand experience of going through each of the stages of the application process for a variety of finance and consulting companies, spilling the beans on what you can expect at each stage, from the online application, video interviews through to the assessment centre. He shares what went well, mistakes he made, what you need to do to stand out from the crowd, and why he recommends that you sign up for the How to Get a Graduate Job course. It’s another inspiring episode today, getting a graduate job can be hard, but Athavan shows you how it is possible, and how if he can do it, you can too. Now the links to the show notes today including a transcript you can download can be found at www.graduatejobpodcast.com/Athavan which is ATHAVAN. Make sure you listen to the end of the episode as I share the date for the relaunch of the How to Get a Graduate Job course, where it will be coming to you with lots of extra bonuses and extra coaching time with me, so if you are serious and want to turbocharge your search for a graduate job and want to get it first time round, then make sure you stick around to hear the details for that. So, without further ado, lets head on over to my chat with Athavan.

James: I am very excited to welcome you to the show today, long time listener, and alumni of the How To Get a Graduate Job course. Welcome to the Graduate Job Podcast, Athavan.

Athavan: Thank you very much for having me James it’s great to be here.

James: Excellent and today we’re going to find out about your story. Yeah, you’ve got about bagging a graduate job with one of the top graduate employers in the country. So, before we get into the details for that, would you want to give listeners a brief introduction to yourself and what you studied?

Athavan: Definitely James, so I’m sure is similar to many of the listeners right now, I’m a recent graduate, graduated in 2019. So not too long, I studied material science and engineering. So, the standard three engineering course. And after the course, I was pretty clueless in terms of the career I wanted to pursue. So, I started to apply to you know just the run of the standard entry-level jobs. Since I was pretty demotivated to apply to graduate jobs since I was always thinking, I wasn’t on par or on the level to apply to a good graduate job. And I did start off by working within an entry-level finance job for around six months. And that’s when I thought if I can do this, why not try for a graduate job, and my graduate job journey started.

James: I have got your application tracker open in front of me, and in the end let’s just see how many, 27 graduate jobs you applied for over the last six months. So, you’ve been very busy. And we’ll explore some of those in more detail as we go along. Maybe me just at the beginning. Why did you decide to join up and sign up for the How To Get a Graduate Job Course?

Athavan: Sure, I mean that’s definitely a good question. So, I was looking at pretty much advice online, in terms of getting a graduate job from a wide variety of sources, from my university’s website careers services. Career services for online, and also, you know, just the generic jobs advice websites, and after going through 10 or 20 resources, I realized that most of them just pretty much say the same thing but in different ways. And that didn’t really help in terms of trying to make me unique as a candidate for applying for graduate jobs. And that’s when I came across your podcast, and I realized that you kind of, the course you offered was a tailored approach in terms of the resources offered, and also the seminars within the course which helped you bring out your own strength rather than rely on what strengths, other resources said. So, uniqueness and also the fact that the service are tailored and your course is pretty unique in terms of what was offered, so I jumped on as soon as I could. 

James: Yeah, but you were one of the early members of the course last year. So, let’s think about your applications. So, how tailored were you in terms of what you wanted to study, where you wanted to apply to? Was it laser focus straight where you knew you wanted to go for finance or were you from umming and arring and thinking more of business-type applications?

Athavan: I believe my previous experience within finance although shorts around six months really helped me kind of see whether if I wanted a job in finance which I definitely did. And so, I tried to stick within the general sphere of finance. But I wasn’t really choosy in terms of which aspect of finance I wanted to go to. So, whether I wanted to go into the industry side in finance leadership programs, or the public side with audit and internal audit within the professional services firms. So, I really tried to go take a balanced approach in terms of applying for a variety of financials peppered with different other roles such as facilities management, just to see what the application processes were like.

James: Yeah, well, we’ll talk in detail about some of the companies that you’ve, you’ve applied to over this period, and we’ll name and shame the ones who’ve been unbelievably slow to, get back to you. Starting at the early stages and with the initial application, I’m just looking here. So, of the 27 companies you apply to you had a 100% record of getting past the initial online application stage, which is brilliant. You know, that’s testament to your CV which looks really, really, really impressive. What did you do in this initial stage to get, make sure you’ve got past every, you’ve got past the first stage of everybody? This is really impressive; the failure rate of this thing can be up to 75% plus. So, to get through every single one you apply to, you know shows you’re doing everything right. Consciously, what were you making sure that you did at this stage?

Athavan: James if you read my CV before I started the course, you would have been surprised because the CV was awfully bad. It was pretty much not tailored for each company, but I believe the real secret for, you know, getting past the stage was the draft CV you had in the initial stage of the course. So, what I really tried to do is tailor each CV application or online application to what the company wanted. And I tried to use specific buzzwords, from the website in terms of what the ATS tracker would pick up. So, the application tracking system, which will lead to a higher success rate. So, I really tried to focus on tailoring my applications to the company, so that my culture and the company’s culture were both really fitting. And I think that was the most key aspect together with the draft CVs and also an example of CVs, you had offered in the course as well. So, it’s just the nature of both, I would say.

James: Good, I’m glad they were useful and yeah, I mean you, did exactly the right thing. As you said there where people tend to let themselves down is coming up with one CV being lazy and then just banging that same one off to all different employers, and if you’re not tailoring it if you’re not making sure that the competencies, they’re looking for is in your CV and the requirements are looking for, sort of nice and prominent, you are setting yourself up to fail. So yeah, you did brilliantly well there.

Athavan: Thanks, James. 

James: So then moving on to the next stage the online testing phase of the process so you know you come from an engineering background, obviously you’re going to be, your applying for finance roles and you’re probably extremely numerate, how did you find this stage of the process? Did you find the numerical aspects quite easy, or was it something you still had to work out?

Athavan: I would say generally the numerical questions weren’t too hard, especially if you come from a STEM background. The main thing would be the time limit so just trying to adjust your pace, and your training to kind of beat the time limit for the different tests. And of course, you had a few tests which weren’t limited by time, such as HMRCs, numerical questions, and the Civil Service. If you look at most private companies, their numerical test is pretty intense in terms of the time limit you had, and how many questions you had to complete within the time limit task. So, I would say that aspect of the online testing phase was pretty tough. And of course, that as cheesy, it’s not as cheesy as it sounds, the only way you’ll get through is to practice, practice, practice, and just get skills, up to the high standard.

James: And how did you find the games-based tests because I know some of the big four firms that apply to have the games-based assessments that we talked about on the show, I’ll link to those in the show notes which today, you can find at Graduate Job Podcast. COM slash Athavan, which is at A T H A V A N, so how did you find the games-based tests?

Athavan: I find that my whole experience is pretty good in terms of, I didn’t see the time flying by, and when doing the assessment. So, I basically downloaded the app on my iPad because it was easier to handle, rather than my phone and I just started doing the assessment it felt more like a game so you had to interact about matching tiles, and yet to keep on popping balloons till they reach a certain level. So, it didn’t really feel like an assessment. Although I did try and keep in the back of my mind, what I could do to improve performance and what they were looking for. But it’s really something you can’t prepare for. So, I would say it’s just, you know, going in there and trying your best really, but it did really feel different in terms of how I can express my qualities in the assessment.

James: Yep. And again, looking at the tracking. So, from the 27 companies, you apply to was only four, when you failed the online testing phase. So, you know, great success there. Where you did fail for some of them was a bit of a shock so Johnson and Matthey and Virgin Media. Could you think of anything that you did specifically wrong with these?

Athavan: That’s a good question actually. I would say maybe it’s just my mood or maybe if I was tired on the day, that might have affected my performance on the day, so I really say it just depends on how your feel as well so it’s really important to get refreshed and feeling on top when you take them. For each time you do the test. So maybe if I’d done it in the evening, I would have been a bit more tired, and it would have been a bit tougher to do the assessments. So, it might have been environmental factors rather than ability, but I would say, you can always practice more, and I was only practicing about maybe once a day, but if I had done more, maybe I could have gone through the assessments, I would say.

James: Yep. And, you know, just looking at the dates for some of these so you probably were doing one a day, around this phase, so they know they’re coming thick and fast so yeah is being fresh, and just being, you know, your best whether that’s in the morning or the afternoon, or evening is, you know, just going to be different for everybody so yeah listeners, make sure that you know when if your circadian rhythm is going to be right for you and just making sure that you’re going to be performing at your best when you do them. 

Athavan: Precisely, and coffee, really helps as well.

James: A good tip there. So then moving on to the video interview phase. So how did you, have you done any video interviews before? This when you started applying for graduate jobs?

Athavan: I would say, I’ve done a phone interview actually way early in the year so last year, and hadn’t really done video interviews before, and especially with the COVID situation, if anything, accelerated the need to do video interviews so it was really a steep learning curve for me.

James: And did you do any recorded video interview or was that just a completely new ballgame?

Athavan: Recorded completely new ball game I would say. I was under the impression that if it was a video interview, it’s going to be live face to face with a representative from the company, asking me questions, but no, it was definitely a new experience for me. 

James: Yep. And so, as part of the course. Listeners the course members can, we can do mock recorded video interviews so where the tailored questions that they’re going to face, depending on the company, and the amount of time is similar to whether it’s two minutes or one minute prep. And then, again, the amount of time that they’re going to need to answer the questions changes per company. So, I set all those up and then we could go through the mock interview and look at them together. How did you find it, going through that process?

Athavan: I would say, it definitely takes your performance to the next level if that makes sense because, however much I practice in front of the mirror, going through my notes, in terms of what I was going to what the potential questions were, and what my potential answers were. It doesn’t really match having another person asking you the questions, and also the fact that, you get a similar experience to what you would experience in the actual video interview. So, when you were interviewing me it basically just felt that the real thing. And I feel like that’s the only way you really get to identify what mistakes you’re making, coming from a different person, and also to get used to the technology I would say, which is the most important thing in terms of setting up the camera and making sure that your mic is okay. Because at the end of the day, successes in video interviews are a combination of both of these I would say.

James: And if my memory serves me right because you invested in a webcam, didn’t you? And make sure you have a decent quality webcam there for the interviews?

Athavan: Definitely so I was actually listening to your podcast with, I think, I can’t recall his name, but you were talking about the video interviews, and I think he published a book on that as well. And I just clicked on the link in the show notes and went on Amazon and just bought the webcam. And, yeah, that turned out to be better than I expected.

James: And it shames me that I can’t remember his name either. So, but listeners, check out the show notes, and I’ll dig out the links to that video interview where you can explore in more detail, what you need to do, to impress in a video interview so you’re not alone there Athavan in forgetting his name. So, what tips would you give people for how they can perform in video interviews?

Athavan: Video interviews I would say for certain companies. I believe there is an algorithm, which looks at how you present yourself and how you communicate information. So, I would say definitely try and not write the script down and kind of utter it out. So, from personal experience, I was applying to Morrison’s graduate scheme. And that was one of my first video interviews, and I have kind of written down a set script for potential questions. And that approach didn’t really go well because I couldn’t really be flexible. And my question to the different questions that were asked in the actual video interview. But what really helped me was just to have a brief set of notes and keywords for generic questions. And so, if there was a surprise question in the video interviews. It really helped me with that question, and for a more flowing answer. I would say definitely have a more flexible approach to video interviews, and also to come across professionally with hand gestures, and to look at the camera directly.

James: That’s great advice, and it’s, yeah, word on the street is a Hire Vue, when people use the Hire Vue tool for video interviews, it’s Yeah. You mentioned a sort of algorithm that takes into account your body language, your enthusiasm, the tone of voice, you know, if you’re wooden and don’t move or if you know you are using hand gestures and looking like you are generally alive. So, listeners, they always tell you which tool, you’re going to be using. So, if you do get told that you are going to be on the Hire Vue platform that’s definitely something to think about is making sure that you are looking animated, and that you’re interested and excited, in the role, which will make a big difference, but yeah, also great, great advice there Athavan. And did you find this stage of the process, one of the most difficult?

Athavan: Yeah, I would say so. It was difficult in some aspect I would say since it’s the first time you really show your face to the company. So, there was the pressure in terms of, you know, expressing the most professional aspect, the professional side of yourself. So, you really wanted to show the company that, this was someone who they wanted to put in front of clients or whoever. So, I would say there was a slight pressure in terms of bringing professionalism out. So that was probably the hardest aspect. On top of trying to match the cultures of what the company was expecting in terms of competencies, and also how to match your previous experience with what they required.

James: And how did you, some of the big four companies, it’s not just standard answer question response video interview but they’re more interactive in terms of having to do, you know, almost like a mini case study. As part of the answer. How do you find those?

Athavan: I just remember that, actually. So, I believe the first few questions, pretty generic. So, in terms of why the company, and why this specific line of service so that more questions you could pretty much answer. I would say near the end of the video interview, there were a few case studies actually. And so, you’re given a bit longer to attend to this question, and you’re also given a longer preparation time. So, for example the question might be, that the specific professional services firm is acquiring a technology company. And so, the question may be, what kind of due diligence or what kind of research would you do to make sure that this merger or acquisition is successful. So, it’s pretty tough in terms of going from zero and trying to do your research in terms of gathering information and specific information that the question required. And trying to form a structure in terms of how you present it back in terms of a video answer. So, it’s both those elements back there, and that was the toughest aspect I would say of those long questions.

James: Yep. Yeah, definitely. They are challenging, and if you aren’t expecting them, then you can be on a hiding to nothing, if they come in completely out of the blue if you’re just only expecting competency questions and you suddenly get a question like that, then you know you can easily start to panic. So, this is where research really is the key and making sure you understand, you know what you can expect from the different companies. So, as we. So, this is looking at the data, so this is October November time. When you are completing and actually the end of September, completing a lot of these video interviews and we were, we’re talking offline about who’s been the slowest companies to go through, and you mentioned Network Rail, so sorry Network Rail. But we are just naming and shaming. You completed that, on the 13th of October and when did you hear back from Network Rail?

Athavan: I’ve actually only heard back then a couple of weeks ago, so I think recording this around, early April. So, it’s quite a few months later that they replied to me saying, they fill the spots. And, you know I mean to someone who really wanted the role that must be really frustrating.

James: Must have been. So that’s five months right waiting five months to hear that you’ve got from one stage to the other, which is, you know that’s not really acceptable. But anyone who is in that position, check out last episode 114, which was where I talked about what to do if you’re on the waiting list for graduate schemes. Which I know is a frustrating place to be. And so how did you feel about this, so it was October November time you’d done a lot of these applications, you’ve done a lot of the tests and the video interviews, and it was quite slow going in terms of companies hearing back. How did you manage to keep your morale up?

Athavan: I would say that’s actually another bit the course helped me to be honest because I kind of knew this going in that there would be the dip, and I don’t want to give too much information out there just in case someone gets demotivated. But when you do sign up for James’ course, I think you go through the dip phase in the beginning. So, I was pretty surprised when I was first heard about it. And, but I was prepared in terms of what to expect. So, I kept my morale up in terms of just by looking at different opportunities out there. And by trying to focus on other things, really, even despite the lockdown so other entertainments and, you know keeping up with the world news, just trying to distract me from the application process. I would say.

James: And, yeah, it’s one of the things that we have covered the first module of the How To Get a Graduate Job course, is just the awareness that looks, you will go through the dip. When you’re applying for graduate jobs, you know, you’re doing great things, and then suddenly you hit this wall of either rejections or radio silence, and it can be really difficult to keep your morale up and keep going. But that’s what you need to do, you know you need to stay positive. And if you’re expecting this stage in the process and it makes it easier to deal with it, so I’m glad, that was useful. So, you are getting them on to the assessment centre stage. But before we jump into the assessment centre stage. Had you, we’re going through the application process. Had your views on the companies that you wanted to work for crystallized had you sort of you know, formed more around whoever you wanted to be professional services, or you wanted to be sort of, you know, finance, in the house for a company? Had you got a definite leaning one way or the other, or were you just entirely waiting on seeing which companies came back as a positive?

Athavan: Yep. So, at first, I really had three categories in play in the beginning, so it was really the public, professional services companies, and the private industry companies, and also the public sector. So, in terms of HMRC, and Civil Service finance scheme. And as I was going through the application process. I really like the regularity and also clear-cut criteria that were available in both public sector grad schemes and also the professional services ones, because with industry, the different companies. Each has totally different application processes, and I believe that the application process also kind of reflects the company and what it is like to work within the company as well. So, in the end I would say definitely got attracted by the professional services company, just in terms of the application process and also the culture. And I believe the culture really attracted me so that’s what really drove me towards that side.

James: Excellent, and by this stage one of the big four who everybody will know invited you along to the assessment centre. Do you want to just talk us through what it was like because it would have been your first assessment centre that you, went to, was it?

Athavan: Yep, that’s right. So, it was a bit manic actually, so this was the first week of December. So actually, one assessment centre, with one of the big four. And a final interview with another big four within the same week, and it was just a bit crazy in terms of preparing for both of them. And, yeah, the good thing was that the generic information so they’re both the same service line. So, that kind of research would benefit both schemes, while the particular research you have to do in terms of what the company we’re doing. And also, what was expected in terms of the culture that I had to differentiate. So, I would say that was the most difficult part of it.

James: And how did you feel the day then how are the nerves going into it were you, cool as a cucumber, or were the nerves getting to you?

Athavan: I definitely tried to start off the day as cool as a cucumber, but you know when the cameras are on. When the stub ends the pressure kicks on. What I would say is definitely about just trying to keep that nerves under and trying to focus on the performance so try and get through the different tasks actually. So, I had to do a wide variety of tasks within the assessment centre. And I’d say it was also draining in terms of just having no breaks going through the whole assessments without any breaks that were another tough aspect I would say.

James: And then walk us through the different tasks that you have to do then on the day, which one came first?

Athavan: So that was, I had to do the video interview first actually weirdly, because usually, they reserve that for the end of this assessment centre, from what I was hearing. But I literally logged on, my assessment centre was all done through webcam. So, and I had to do the video interview straightaway. So that was a bit unexpected but managed to get through that decently, there weren’t any surprise questions I would say it was just the general generic. Why this company, why this service line. What do you know about the industry and other questions, which would follow this. And then following this I did do a numerical-based assessment. But the weird thing was with this specific company. You had to manage your own time so there wasn’t a set base of exercises. 

So, there were numerical questions, verbal questions, group discussions, which he had to attend a Zoom meeting. So, it almost felt as if I was working within the company. So, you know, reading through emails, few inboxes, e-tray exercises. So, I’d say, a key aspect of that was managing my time, so I kind of formed a rough timetable of what I was going to do. So, I realized that I’d be faster with numeric questions. So, I tried to put, you know, half an hour of that, and then I’ll take a bit longer with essay-based questions, so I tried to allocate a bit more time so an hour for that. So, I tried to tie my plan, to plan my time sorry. Just five minutes before I started on going to the different tasks. And so that was definitely a unique experience.

James: Ah brilliant and you clearly did the right thing there and taking that time in the beginning just to do the planning, you know, every part of your body is urging you just to start and you’re under time pressure, let’s get going. If you can just take a step back and do that planning is invaluable just for making sure that you are (A) you know exactly what you need to be doing and (B) you can just, you know, can add that structure so you did really well there.

Athavan: Thank you, James. 

James: So, what came after the testing phase, did you have any group exercises to do?

Athavan: Yep. So, I believe there’s a set time for the group exercise so after doing all of this testing phases, I had to pop onto, I believe it’s Google meet, video sorry a group exercise. And there were two-three or four other people. And we had to basically research about, I believe it’s a company, acquiring another business in Europe. But the weird aspect was that I had to do external research within the time, so that didn’t really help in terms of the preparation I did before, but I would say, what really helped me was just trying to talk to the different people within the group assessment and trying to form a relationship with them. And once you got through that initial, you know, breaking the ice barrier. The conversation was a bit more flowing in terms of reaching the solution, rather than trying to get through formalities.

James: And I mean,on the course with the group members we did a mock group exercise, and you know you performed really well in that. So, I was confident that you’d do the same as well and in the real-life experience. How did you find the other people, did you as a group did you all get on okay with the people who tried to, you know, with a louder than everyone else and tried to monopolize the decision making, or was it all nice and chilled and everybody’s all working together?

Athavan: Yep, so I think definitely doing that mock group assessment, helped me in terms of, like, identifying what kind of group dynamics, I would need to take on so what kind of role, there were. And going in, I would say it was pretty okay for me. Obviously if everyone was trying to get the point in which made it harder for us to reach the solution or the objective of the group discussion. But from doing the mock assessment I really identified what aspects I could play octaves, for example, taking the role of the note keeper, or a timekeeper rather. And also, just to bring other people into the discussion if they were being particularly quiet. Since you’re engaging all members of the group which always adds on brownie points, I would say at the end of the day and makes you look good, within a group assessment.

James: Definitely, yeah that’s a, you know, you mentioned a couple of the key things there and yeah if you can, in a group exercise, I guarantee you there will be people who are quieter than others, whether it’s because they’ve got a rubbish internet connection and they’ve got a slight lag or they’re just, you know, quieter. You know if you can be the person who’s demonstrating leadership, demonstrating group awareness by pausing the group, bringing these people in given an opportunity to speak and add their content. Then he said, that’s going to be plenty of marks for you. So yeah, I’m sure you did that really well during the actual exercise. So, any as a group did you manage to complete the task on time as per expectations?

Athavan: Definitely I would say that’s one thing I learned so when we were doing that mock group assessment. We left it too close in terms of trying to reach a solution. So, that point was really hammered on to me. So, when I was doing the actual group assessment. Five minutes before our deadline I tried to bring together the idea as a group. So, what our solution was, and everyone realized, oh yeah, we only have five minutes left. Yeah, to kind of conclude and bring together our points to identify one solution. So, in that kind of aspect, I believe our group did pretty well in terms of just trying to agree to find the best solution.

James: Excellent. And after the group exercise were there any more tasks, or was that the end of the day?

Athavan: So, I actually had to do a kind of a feedback contrast so how on the questions and how the day went. And what I learned from the day. And I don’t believe it was assessed, or maybe wrong.

James: Everything’s always assessed. 

Athavan: Yeah, so it’s always, you know, even with that kind of exercise it always pays to put your best self forward in terms of just being professional about what you enjoyed the day and how you find the overall assessment procedure.

James: Okay. So that was the end of the assessment centre and I’m sure you. Well, you did amazingly. How long was it then that you found out, either the yeah or the nay?

Athavan: I was actually pretty surprised I was preparing myself to wait for the Christmas holidays, and then maybe get the result, but the company was pretty quick, they got the result back to me, or rather I should say call back to me within five days. So definitely on the quick side. 

James: And what was the outcome?

Athavan: It was definitely good news as in, I believe it was someone from the recruitment team call me and just offered me the job. And I was just, you know, putting me in a really good mood after that call.

James: I was over the moon myself when you told me so I can imagine how excited you would have been. The just before Christmas so nice. The nice time you could go into the Christmas break. Yeah, with an offer in your back pocket for one of the big four, do amazing work. What were your thoughts then on that, was it called? Got the job, that’s it. Cancel everything else, not bothered, or because you were still in the process for some of the other big four companies as well weren’t you at the time?

Athavan: Yeah. I would say that this was, ideally the job I did want to pursue. So, I was less motivated in terms of doing other assessment centres. So, I’ve pretty much firmed that this was the career path I was going to take for the future, I’d say.

James: It’s when you get the offer it does help you crystallize whether you know, this is a company that you want to work for and you said, right, it comes all the way through the process. If the company is dealing with you in a really friendly, professional, quick way, it leaves you with a nice warm glow right. And you think I could actually work it but if you’re, you know, if you’re taking five months to get back to you each stage of the process, it’s not filling you with, you know, the same pleasant feelings, or if there has to be arsey through the process. So, yeah, it’s you do know as you go through the process. Yeah, I can see myself working here or not.

Athavan: No, it definitely isn’t, it sets the culture, I would say you get to have almost like a taste of the company, if that makes sense, and to see if they fit your own personality.

James: So, you did for one of the other big four, you had a got through to the final partner interview.  Do you might just want to share with us your experiences of that and just how you found the whole process?

Athavan: Definitely. That one was definitely way shorter than the full-on assessments, so it was just a one-hour call with a manager of the office. And firstly, started off just with generic on-the-go questions. So why the company, why the specific line of service, and a few competency questions going through. But then near the end, they got more informed, so it was more case study-based questions. So, you were introduced to different case studies, and you, I think got a few things and time is also about five minutes 10 minutes thinking time to come up with an answer, and kind of feedback to the manager, in terms of what your solution would be. And I kind of got the glimpse that they weren’t looking for the specific answers but rather what your thought process was and how you organize your thinking to come up with the most logical answer. So, I would say that was the most important aspect for us from the longer questions.

James: Definitely, how was the manager, was he quite informal or whatever you know sticking to a script and just going entirely by that?

Athavan: I was pretty surprised actually, they were really informal so in terms of they stopped the script, all the way. But they were informal in how they followed up with the question. So, if I had, for example, the competency questions, if I, for example, talked about my experience with archery during university they were pretty interested in terms of what I did. And they were pretty informed in that aspect as well which was good, actually, because it put me in a sense of ease. So that was definitely a positive experience I would say.

James: Excellent. And, you know, I’m sure you can, you did really well in this. But you as we talked about it earlier with the waiting list. You added to the, you passed it, but you added to the general dreaded waiting list waiting for this specific company.

Athavan: Exactly, yeah. So, it was just the email and wasn’t calling anything so just informed me I was part of the waiting list.

James: Which it pays to, each stage of the process, try and go through them as quickly as possible, you know, get your application in as quickly as possible, up to the required standard, of course, you know, they’ll give you a week to do the online tests. Ideally, you’ve been practicing so there’s no need to wait for the week. You know, if you’re ready to go on day one boom get in on day one, and each stage. Each day you can get in quicker, you’ll just be ahead of so many other people, and you’ll just get through the process so much quicker. And, you know, minimize the chances that you’ll be on a waiting list for a job that might or might not ever appear. So Athavan, let’s look back then reflectively over the sort of the process, as a whole. What advice would you wish you could give yourself in this, you know, putting yourself in the pre-application phase what advice would you wish, you’d known?

Athavan: I would say, I would have told myself that applying to graduate schemes, it’s a job itself. And it’s a skill that you can develop and to not feel demotivated. So, when you’re looking at this, you know way back in September. It’s easy to feel overwhelmed and put off the applications which I definitely did. And, but I’d say it’s definitely about taking the next step, as you described, James. I believe, rather than looking at the process as a whole from September to when you do get the offer later in the year. So, it definitely helps to break it down into smaller steps and trying to execute each small step, and not to look at the long-term view, so it’s easy to feel demotivated, it’s easy to put off the applications. But it pays to persevere, and break it down and do the small steps, so that’s what I would say to myself if I was in my shoes back in September.

James: Excellent, now that’s brilliant advice, and yeah, it’s daunting right it’s scary, it’s, you know you’re putting yourself out there for people you don’t know to cast judgment on you and possibly reject you from jobs that you might or might not want to get in the first place. So, it is a scary process but yeah, one step at a time, and, you know, that’s how you get through it. And you did amazingly right. You worked hard, your CV was excellent you practiced the video interviews, you practiced the tests, you know, you got a graduate offer for one of the biggest employers in the country. An amazing role, you know, amazing opportunities, and you start properly next week.

Athavan: Definitely looking forward to that. But I’d also like to add on James that it wasn’t only me. I think what another aspect which really helped was meeting the other graduates in the course as well, because it’s always nice to you know go on some journey and it was good to go through, you know, other people on the graduate course, and that really helped me in terms of you know, motivation, even meeting up with them every week gave me something to look forward to as well. So, that’s another aspect.

James: Yeah, and I’m so pleased with the private Facebook group for just the course members, and you know people sharing their success, and everybody just been, you know, really excited for each other, you know, sharing the questions they are facing, the challenges they’re facing, you know the difficult time people were facing at different stages. It was great to see you so yeah, I’m glad that was, you know you found benefit from that. And listeners, you know, if you want to check out the course, then go to, how to get a graduate job.com and you will find details of how you can sign up just like Athavan has done. So, let’s move on to our weekly staple questions Athavan. I’m interested to hear your responses here today. So, the first question, what one book would you point listeners to, that they should read today?

Athavan: One book, that’s certainly a hard question James, but I would definitely say Striking Thoughts, by Bruce Lee. I wouldn’t say it’s a popular book, but it’s a definitely unique book. I would say. You know, sorry when you think of Bruce Lee, you think of him as a martial artist, but he is a blend of both martial artist and philosopher, and it’s pretty interesting to read his views on different aspects of life.

James: Amazing. I had no idea that Bruce Lee had written a book, so I will check that one out myself. That sounds fascinating, and listeners, check it out in the show notes at Graduate Job Podcast. COM slash Athavan, which is a t h a v a n. So Athavan, next question what one website or internet resource would you point listeners towards?

Athavan: I would say one website I found really interesting was 1000 years of careers advice.com. So, I find this pretty late actually but if I would find this earlier especially, I think they have a book on it, that shows you what kind of career advice that different people from different sectors give. And that was pretty interesting to read and James right if I can break the rules slightly and suggest another website. And so, it’s not really a website, it’s just Google, but it’s the new search function so whenever you are trying to get information about a company. Just type the company’s name on Google and go on to the news section rather than the web search, and it gives you a whole list of news articles from which you can gather information.

James: That is a good one and also just building on that one is you can set up a Google news alert, so if your company in question, you can set up an alert with Google so they will send you an email every day when that specific company or specific terms exactly that you type in, come up with, then that will, they’ll send you an email for that. So, check that one out, and I’ll link to that in the show notes, and Athavan were you aware that 1000 years of career advice is a cracking book and a great website. And did you know that I had Paul on the show?

Athavan: I didn’t James, no. 

James: Well, there you go. So, episode 73 listeners 1000 years of career advice with Paul Murphy, he chatted to 100 People 10 years out of university, and spoke to them all, and got their career advice for what they would tell their younger selves. And what they’ve learned over the course of the 10 years. But yeah, great resource, and yeah, a top tip there Athavan. Thank you for that one. 

Athavan: No problem I’ll be checking that out myself. 

James: And the final question today what one tip would you give listeners that they can implement today to help them on their job search?

Athavan: Definitely reflecting back to what I said before and try and break it down into whatever problem you’re having with your graduate job search or whatever it is. To try and break it down into smaller tasks that you can accomplish even in the form of bullet points, really helps you kind of put into perspective what you need to do. So that’s one tip I’ll give.

James: Excellent. Athavan, thank you so much for appearing on the Graduate Job Podcast, and good luck and all the best with your amazing upcoming career with one of the biggest companies in the country, and one of the big four.

Athavan: Awesome James Thank you very much for having me. I definitely enjoyed my time.

James: There you go, many thanks again to Athavan for sharing his insight and knowledge today of going through those graduate job application processes and all the best for your career at PwC. You are a star and I’ve no doubt that you will do well.  So there you go, another successful and satisfied member of the How to Get a Graduate Job. We had Jack in episode 115, Callum in episode 116, and Athavan here in 117. It worked for them, and it will work for you. I’ll be relaunching the course with some brilliant special bonuses on the 1st of August, so put that date in your diary. That’s the 1st of August. Put a note in your phone as I will be offering the course for a very short time with some brilliant extra goodies including one on one coaching sessions with me. So what should you do if you want to follow in Athavan and Callum and Jack’s footsteeps?  said, if you want to get a graduate job you need this course! What should you do right now? Visit https://howtogetagraduatejob.com, specifically https://howtogetagraduatejob.com/5steps/ that’s the number 5 and the steps, as that will take you to my free download where I share the 5 steps you must take before applying for graduate jobs. I’ll then be able to keep in touch with you and let you know what you need to do to sign up for my course and just how you can get it with the hundreds of pounds of free extras. It’s going to be bigger and better this year, and you aren’t going to want to miss out. I promise you that, so head to https://howtogetagraduatejob.com/5steps/ Right, I’ll leave it there, I hope you enjoyed the episode today, but more importantly, I hope you use it, and apply it. See you next week.